WATCH: Kelly Presses Intelligence Chiefs on Use of Unsecured Channels for Military Deliberations

Today, during a Senate Intelligence Committee hearing on worldwide threats, Arizona Senator and Navy combat veteran Mark Kelly pressed senior intelligence officials on the risks of discussing sensitive national security matters over unsecured platforms—stressing that any military deliberation, if intercepted, could be exploited by adversaries. 

Kelly’s questioning follows reporting that a Signal group chat that included Vice President JD Vance, Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth, CIA Director John Ratcliffe, DNI Tulsi Gabbard, other top national security officials, and, inadvertently, a journalist contained sensitive deliberations related to potential U.S. military action in Yemen that was subsequently acted upon. Kelly pressed on what specific topics were discussed in the chat that could be exploited—including targets for strikes—and whether such discussion should ever occur on unsecured platforms.  

During the hearing, Kelly pointed to existing DoD security policy on the use of mobile applications and pressed the officials on the appropriateness of the content shared over Signal: “Controlled Unclassified Information, according to DoD, includes information that has not been approved for public release. Of what’s been disclosed publicly on the Signal chain, would either of you feel that that would be approved for public release?” 

He followed up with a question to CIA Director Ratcliffe about how such deliberations should be handled: “Mr.  Ratcliffe, the deliberation between principals in our national security apparatus about whether or not to strike another country—would you consider that to be classified information?” 

To which Director Ratcliffe acknowledged the sensitivity of this information, saying: “Pre-decisional strike deliberations should be conducted through classified channels.” 

Click here to download a video of Kelly’s exchange. See the transcript below: 

Sen. Kelly: Thank you, Mister chairman. I’m going to come back to the topic of the day here. The Signal chain, as reported by the Atlantic. Ms. Gabbard and Mister Ratcliffe, you each testified that there was no information operational, in nature, no classified information. So, I want to ask each of you just a series… just respond yes or no. I’ll start with Miss Gabbard in the Signal chain that we have been talking about, was there any mention of a target in Yemen?  

Tulsi Gabbard, Director of National Intelligence: I don’t remember mention of specific targets.  

Sen. Kelly: Any generic target?  

Director Gabbard: I believe there was discussion around targets in general.  

Sen. Kelly:  Mister Ratcliffe?  

John Ratcliffe, Director of Central Intelligence Agency: I think that’s consistent with my recollection. Again, I don’t have access to that.  

Sen. Kelly: Was there any mention, Miss Gabbard, of a weapon or weapons system?  

Director Gabbard: I don’t recall specific weapons systems being named.  

Sen. Kelly: I’m not talking about specifics. Any weapon or weapon system? 

Director Gabbard: I don’t recall specific names of systems or weapons being used or named within the channel.  

Sen. Kelly: Well, I don’t want you to tell me what the specific weapon was, but any weapon at all. Mister Ratcliffe, same question.  

Director Ratcliffe: I don’t recall.  

Sen. Kelly: How about anything about timing? Miss Gabbard?  

Director Gabbard: I don’t recall specific timing. And I won’t get into the details of the conversation, but obviously there was a significant amount of planning and internal discussions that had occurred prior to and outside of this Signal chat.  

Sen. Kelly: Mister Ratcliffe, you’re nodding your head. Any mention of any military unit whatsoever? Mister Ratcliffe?  

Director Ratcliffe: Not that I recall.  

Sen. Kelly: Miss Gabard?  

Director Gabbard: Not that I recall.  

Sen. Kelly: Ok, so I understand that DoD policy prohibits discussion of even what is called Controlled Unclassified Information or CUI on unsecured devices. Are both of you aware of that DoD policy?  

Director Gabbard: I haven’t read that policy.  

Director Ratcliffe: Not familiar with the DoD policy, but I would say that the Secretary of Defense is the original classification authority for DoD in deciding what would be classified information.  

Sen. Kelly: Ms. Gabbard does the Intelligence Community have a policy that prohibits discussion of controlled unclassified information.  

Director Gabbard: Yes.  

Sen. Kelly: It does, OK. Controlled Unclassified Information, according to DoD, includes information that has not been approved for public release. Of what’s been disclosed publicly of the Signal chain, would either of you feel that that would be approved for public release? Miss Gabbard?  

Director Gabbard: The discussion that took place in that Signal chat group was a conversation reflecting national security leaders and the Vice President around the President’s objectives.  

Sen. Kelly: So, yes or no, would you approve that for public release?  

Director Gabbard: I don’t feel I can answer that question here.  

Sen. Kelly: Because of the nature of this hearing?  

Director Gabbard: Because of the nature of a private discussion that took place between individual leaders and our government.   

Sen. Kelly: It would make sense that you would not approve it for public release, wouldn’t it?  

Director Gabbard: There are other factors that would go into that consideration.  

Sen. Kelly: Ok, Mister Ratcliffe, yes, or no?  

Director Ratcliffe: I wouldn’t approve the release of classified information. Again, as I’ve said, my understanding is…  

Sen. Kelly: I’m not talking about classified information, Mister Ratcliffe. I’m talking about information that has not been approved for public release. That is information that is considered controlled unclassified information.  

Director Ratcliffe: The principals that would have been on that would have been individuals capable of approving that for public release.  

Sen. Kelly: Do you? I got twenty seconds. The deliberation as to whether or not we should launch a strike on another country. Would you consider that classified information, Miss Gabbard?  

Director Gabbard: The information was not classified.  

Sen. Kelly: I’m not talking about this. I’m just talking about deliberation, principals, as to whether or not we should launch a strike on another country. Would you consider that classified information? I’m not talking about what happened this week.  

Director Gabbard: There are other factors that would go into determining that classification.   

Sen. Kelly: Mister Ratcliffe, the deliberation between principals in our national security apparatus about whether or not to strike another country, would you consider that to be classified information?  

Director Ratcliffe: Pre-decisional strike deliberation should be conducted through classified channels.  

Sen. Kelly: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.